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mike

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Sorry. You have to be registered to access this content.

Jeridian

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My opinion isn't much since I don't play any of those games at tournament level but I think the lack of a Final is a very good thing, it means your playing at the GW Tournament to enjoy that tournament rather than to compete for a free ticket to the next tournament.
Previously, if your still in contention for a Final ticket it looms over you and can make WAAC moves highly likely.
With no final, if your not in contention for the top 3 or top 10, you can just enjoy the games for what they are.

Don't get me wrong, many tournament goers enjoy the cut throat side, but I didn't, it's one of the reason I don't go.

Urban Knight

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I think the change Sucks - it means I'll never be able to win the GT Final - The best I can do is win a Heat and I've already done that twice

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Last edited by Urban Knight (2010-03-26 20:38:07)

Greater Harlequin

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I assume this means there will just be 4 seperate tournaments with no overall winner and no free weekend? If that's the case I predict a loss of interest from abroad. The draw of attending the heats plus a free final and the chance to win the top trophy in the world must have been a strong attraction. Be interesting to see what happens.

No mention of the doubles?

Oh Allen, I have just realised I can never win the final either....................bugger it !!!!

I assume we will have to use these seasonal events in a co-ordinated way, ie make one a flame on massive outing?

blessed knight

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Greater Harlequin wrote:
Oh Allen, I have just realised I can never win the final either....................bugger it !!!!

I assume we will have to use these seasonal events in a co-ordinated way, ie make one a flame on massive outing?

does open up the challenge of being the first 4 season winner though.

Urban Knight

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Greater Harlequin wrote:
Oh Allen, I have just realised I can never win the final either....................bugger it !!!!

I feel your pain

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Last edited by Urban Knight (2010-03-27 07:51:34)

Greater Harlequin

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Urban Knight wrote:
Greater Harlequin wrote:
Oh Allen, I have just realised I can never win the final either....................bugger it !!!!
I feel your pain

Thought you would!

The Fallen Angel

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Agreee with sentiments above. It does seem a very business minded decision to get more money out of us, particularly if they don't lower the cost.

I can see it making it less competitive and more fun when you've lost drawn a game as there's nothing to play for but can imagine the winning tables would be a lot more tense as its your only shot at winning.

skcuzzlebumm

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Agreeing with the fact its monetary decision, they are a business.

Do it think its a good move, personally no. Its a very prestigious event and something which is unique to the UK. I think GW are loosing something special here.

Is it going to make the events any less competitive, not a chance. Just think back to the conflicts, they were as cut-throat as it came at the top.

Will I go to one of these (I can see plenty of people trying for all 4)? Most defiantly, especially if everyone else goes. Like Graham says, pick one and make it a massive Flame On outing/social (maybe the one that falls on the old final date?).

End of the day playing in tourneys is something I really enjoy. I really liked the GT final as it often meant meeting up with all the regulars from the other heats and having a few beers. That comradeship is going to be lost which is a real shame.

In fact looking at the calander there is only 1 40k and 1 WFB 'Grand' Tournament this year, in Oct for WFB and Nov for 40k. Guessing these are going to sell out very fast.

Wonder when the others are? Its going to be interesting to see which non-GW events they clash with as for 8 years now people have planned their events around the GT's in Oct/Nov.

Though this does potentially open up some space for BotC Doubles..... mmmmm.

Mad Larkin Uk

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I think we should bully GW into reversing this. If worst comes to worst, i wouldnt have minded them putting the price up a bit rather than doing this. Its gutting the UK tournement scene, and we cant stand for it. Ive already informed them that i wont be going to any of these 'Grand' Tourneys, and they make me very angry!!!!

UNHAPPY FACE!

Added 03.27.2010 11:01:04:

Sorry. You have to be registered to access this content.

I got Active.

skcuzzlebumm

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Right so it looks like the WFB tourney organisers are all over this and are planning to run some regional heats with a grand final.

Sorry. You have to be registered to access this content.

I think this is a great idea, having geographically based heats will open up the whole experience to more people, thereby helping the 40k tourney scene as a whole.

So as a 40k Tourney Organiser I have to say I am very much up for following the WFB guys lead on this and sorting out regional events with a national final. As it will be player driven we should be able to offer more of what everyone wants at a price that makes everyone happy.

What do people think and who (if any) is with me?

Ade

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Mad Larkin Uk wrote:
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/ukgt

I got Active.

Ha Ha - good luck with that

Jeridian

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I did my bit for the petition by pissing into the wind this morning.

I think your best bet is to run your own Heats and Final tournaments, even better it will probably be cheaper than Throne of Skulls.

Russ

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Bah I knew they'd be some change to stop me trying to qualify for the next final on a modelling basis.

The problem with any player run attempt at a replacement is that it's going to end up comped up to the eyeballs.

skcuzzlebumm

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No I think, as someone elsewhere mentioned, for any independent player run event to work you have to replace like for like.

So that means aiming for the same kind of scenery, boards and facilities as WHW (or as close to) and the same style of non-comp rules pack.

There are more than enough comp events these days, non comp still has its appeal and needs a venue.

anathema

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Ramble alert:

Organising your own regional heats and finals is great, but all they really do is add another set of events to the independent calendar. Like it or not, the official GW GT events are seen as being set apart from the tournament circuit. Personally I always thought that independent events generally give a better atmosphere, the couple of WPS 40K GT I went to were great due to the relaxed atmosphere and the comp, but it was the players that made it.

If you want the GT tournament regular crowd, then you'll generally see most of them at other events too. If you want WHW terrain and facilities, then you can go to Open War, BotCh etc. If you want the GT prestige, then you're going to have to go to the GT.

However, if you really want to make an indpendent event to rival the GT you're going to have to make it awesome. As an example in Flames of War, the tournaments are all independent, yet some stand out as the big ones that I will make an extra effort to attend.. This is due to either the size of the field and being a good overall event(Britcon), the format ie. themed events or just the overall package where you have great terrain, a handy venue, a great but not wacky format and a large field such as the recent Corrivalry event. To me, after the recent first event, this tournament has now become an absolute must-go for next year for me.

Get a great venue, amazing terrain (really important to my mind, amazing boards really make a difference in my perception of the event) and a great format that will appeal to the majority of tournament regulars (who'll be the majority of first-time attendees) and it'll become the big one, otherwise its just another addition to the crowded calendar. Like the ETC was something special while Open War is just another event.

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Last edited by anathema (2010-03-27 19:48:47)

skcuzzlebumm

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Dave that is entirely the plan; top quality venue like say Maelstorm with professional boards, terrain and facilities.

Not somewhere towns local town hall with cloth tables and hand me down terrain.

Like you say it has to be exceptional.

Nature Boy

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skcuzzlebumm wrote:
Dave that is entirely the plan; top quality venue like say Maelstorm with professional boards, terrain and facilities.

Not somewhere towns local town hall with cloth tables and hand me down terrain.

Like you say it has to be exceptional.

Agreed. What we need is a commitee (that will eventually have to be elected but lets not get ahead of ourselves) that represents all of the areas running regional qualifiers to over see the overall running of the tournament.

I would like to throw my hat into the ring to represent the midlands.

And with regard to prestinge lets use boxing as an example, the wbc belt used to be the most prestigious but the governing body made so many bad decisions that gradually others over took them. The IBF is the one to hold now. The PDC in darts broke away taking the best players with them and gradually the original darts organisation (the BDO) have lost all prestige. It takes time but can be done.

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Last edited by Nature Boy (2010-03-28 01:12:38)

McKraken

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The Fallen Angel wrote:
Agreee with sentiments above. It does seem a very business minded decision to get more money out of us, particularly if they don't lower the cost.

I can see it making it less competitive and more fun when you've lost drawn a game as there's nothing to play for but can imagine the winning tables would be a lot more tense as its your only shot at winning.

Very definitely business decision, after all if you qualified for the final you get a free extra tournament.........

I don't like it personally, as it probably lowers the average player quality (unless you end up in a tourney with all the top guys), but GW don't even run tourneys in the US, so I'm just grateful they are offering something here still.

Grotsmeg

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I think we will all miss the old format of the GT.
Personally I wouldnt normally agree with pettitions and such like but in this case, I think its one of those things were people power could win out.
Sportsmen do it, Z list Celebrities do it, even emasculated slaves do it. Lets do it.
Basically if every tournament gamer actually feels this is a bad move for the hobby vote with your cash and boycott the New style GT. (or throne of blood!)

Yes GW like every company has to make hard decisions in hard times, but the G.T. is one tournament that brought out the best and the worst, for me it will just become another tournament and probably not a special one at that. If i cared enough i would make a stand along with the other gamers who feel strongly enough about it.
But to be honest i will probably just cross it off my list as too much cash for too little and find another tournament (or 2) im more likely of enjoying for the same price.
Then again if it becomes a group of us getting together to swamp a tourney then the extra cash could be worth it.

anathema

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IMO GW won't give a damn if a few people won't go out of principle, all 4 events will still sell out (they always have and I can't see that changing) and they'll make 33% more cash. In a few years most of the players will be new guys to the GT and tournament scene who won't know any different and they won't care.

If you want to keep a heat/final system going, best bet is to support a big independent event that does it, but without that 'official GW' stamp it won't be the same to the majority of GT attendees. Wrong or not, people feel its a big achievement to win the official GWGT while the guy who won 40K at Toy Soldier, Open War or Club Challenge is just another guy at an event they've never heard of.

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Last edited by anathema (2010-03-30 14:13:40)

Grotsmeg

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{quote}IMO GW won't give a damn if a few people won't go out of principle, all 4 events will still sell out (they always have and I can't see that changing) and they'll make 33% more cash. In a few years most of the players will be new guys to the GT and tournament scene who won't know any different and they won't care. {/quote}

Agreed the only way it will work is enough players boycott it so that it doesnt sell out, I.E. like the RATM number 1 (which actually boosted the sales of both projected number 1's if i heard it right! sop maybe not like that.... more like the boycotted SA cricket tour back when i was a lad, either the 70's or 80's.)
So yes the only way that will work is if the whole G.T. is boycotted by the players en MASSE and their ticket sales fall so low its becomes a cost not a profit. Problem is even if that did happen i think they would take a hit on the first year knowing that the next year it will be back to normal, or just cancel the whole think and leave it to other people to run the tournaments.

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Last edited by Grotsmeg (2010-03-30 14:32:13)

anathema

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So yes the only way that will work is if the whole G.T. is boycotted by the players en MASSE and their ticket sales fall so low its becomes a cost not a profit.

Never going to happen IMO. I reckon that the majority of GT goers aren't regular forum goers so wouldn't hear of a boycott and more importantly wouldn't care and still go anyway. There's definitely more than 600 people who would go to the 4 events, not to mention repeat attendees. Hell, some people think it will improve the events as well.

If the community feels that strongly about it it either has to go one better or go home.

Bigger Mek

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I love this idea as it plays right into the hands of people who play for fun. Im sick of being mid way up the tables last game and getting some guy who is so desperate to qualify that he will do anything including cheat, cry, ask for every rule to be clarified even if that involves shouting the ref over countless times and generally being an unsporting ass even when all hope of winning fades.
Its simple to see how they have done it, why have 3 events where you make money and one where you make non (take away cost of staff, venue costs and food against the only profit maker that day which is bugmans). I personally hope they go ahead with this and keep it, doubt the foreigners will be put off, most of them come just to play ive met few with the “must win win win for the club” mentality, which to be frank spoils it all for me. In the end it’s a game and the basis is around two things for GW, first being the chance for people to have a weekend of fun playing new players that they wouldn’t normally get a chance to play and secondly as a business it’s a chance to make money and encourage players to keep playing hence keep buying their product. Gaming clubs are not unions, if you don’t like it there is always someone else who will buy the ticket instead.
End ramble

Scumgrief

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I can see why competitive players would be irked by this as the final did carry a lot of prestige. But in my own personal opinion people place to much emphasis on their placement in the tables rather than having fun games. I don't think the tourneys will be any less competitive or fun because of this change.

Again in my personal opinion I think the important thing to come out of this is now 25% more people can take part in a Throne of Skulls tournament because the 4th heat wont be limited to the lucky or skilled few that qualified from earlier rounds. It should make buying a ticket easier and hopefully there wont be as many disappointed people when they sell out.

Flame On Forum

Throne of Skulls format announcement

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Re: Throne of Skulls format announcement

Re: Throne of Skulls format announcement

Re: Throne of Skulls format announcement

Re: Throne of Skulls format announcement

Greater Harlequin wrote:

Re: Throne of Skulls format announcement

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Urban Knight wrote:

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Mad Larkin Uk wrote:

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The Fallen Angel wrote:

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Re: Throne of Skulls format announcement

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